Open forum for Dual Wielder's healthy progress: Let's brainstorm and share our thoughts!

eh well.. dw isn't gonna be defensively buffed as other chars anyway in the long run...
its main defense is dodge and possibly eva because agi,str and dex thats a lot of stat points to drain into
and imo, DW probably won't have a chance to pump in VIT unless you are 1.) tank dw or something 2.) some ATK UP [VIT] gear comes out
so we're forced to go refine add gear and armor to +C or more to function defensively

bryan's dw is fine as it is as long as he doesn't let his DW die in one hit... vita 2 is so cheap now its really not an issue it just clunks up 1 spot on your storage but that's it...

 

Most of the players in Toram can be classified as a "I don't care how I look like in boss battles or if this boss can actually easily kill me because of my squishiness/poor manual defensive reflex, as long as I can see High numbers in my damage output. I'm ok with that. I will sacrifice everything even if it could spell death just as long as it will boost my damage output overall. They'll kill the boss if I die anyway so .. Why bother?" kind of player(s).

DW needs a very specific and unique approach to succeed. I mean, you can be successful from your own, especially if you pioneered some build(s). From that way , it will reflect your way of thinking and your overall knowledge. But considering the fact that someone disregards the most important part for every build which is survivability, then I will disagree only against that part.

 

Hmm... Its a good idea thought.

I may consider in changing my Jade for Roga coz I already had too much MP & AMPR. And, Im just using 1MP combos. I had 1300MaxMP so a reduce 300MP is not that bad.

 

I never said it was messed up. I simply pointed at a few problems about some of his choices. If he's well aware of them and attempts to find alternate routes, I'm going shut up and call that a good build.

Fair enough. In fact, I reconsidered my statement about AGI vs STR and have gotten to a conclusion that STR>AGI in terms of DPS if you're already pouring some points into DEX and have a good crit rate.

I don't have the exact formulas for everything yet (there's sites that speculate that, but we can't take their info for granted), but I can guarantee you one thing: if you have a good crit rate (and seems like you do), CDMGx% will ALWAYS be better than ATKx%. Let me explain.
In these types of games, it's common for damage formulas to be like this:
(Atk_value + random_number_A)*multiplier + random_number_B
ATKx% will increase Atk_value. What it won't do, however, is to increase random numbers A and B. CDMGx% will. Why? Because crit multipliers are always applied AFTER the formula is calculated. The only case where ATKx% and CDMGx% do the exact same thing is when A and B are equal to 0, and that's unlikely for skills. This is supposing that we crit, however; ATKx% is the overall winner should your crit rate be low.

That's a bit of a bold statement there. Joining a mage only party is not going to be possible if the boss hard counters mages (high magic resistance for example).
Also, the thing about proration isn't just about enhancing your damage, it's also to be a team player by enhancing everyone's damage. Everyone benefits from proration, and DW happens to be the best class for that alongside Brawlers.

I won't discuss about the rest, because it's more linked to your personal choices for your build.

 

Tnx for the Info guys. Now I knew what I should Improve on my current build.

Btw I agree too on Groot LOL Vita 2 is too cheap in El Scaro so its not really an issue on buying them

 

Okay.... I guess @TheXIIIthGuy already explain ur equipment mistakes and squishy. And @Cypherian already explain DW niche.

Now my point is, what's ur point on building your DW? What's ur vision or purpose for your DW? everything you do or build without purpose or copying will never work.
I don't see any specific purpose for ur DW at all.... is it prorate? tank? DPS? It's so unclear. If you rley on 90% twin slash the damage output itself will be super low.... u pull no aggro with short combo, and no breaking skill....
Without any purpose, when u r in party u'll be like random player who help slashing the boss randomly when other player ignore you.

 

Yep ^^ second is mine! >

 

The real purpose of my build is having a little bit of everything. A balance build that can do consistent & quick damage, utility & survival.

Even if u say that Im too squishy, I dont really had a problem tanking theres too many ways a DW can survive.

I already said my reasons on using Twin Slash so I will just repeat it again. I
knew its not a good dps combo, but it gives me consistent damage coz Twin always crit if its after Shadow & if it crits it had a boosted CDMG. I also thought that having Twin Slash as my main damaging skill is more suitable coz it has the fastest
animation compare with charging & phantom. It is suitable in using in a my two short motion boosting combos that I use for auto canceling.

I spam those two short combos reapetedly with auto canceling between them with this method I mostly get the aggro & tank. About breaking I had a defensive & breaker combo that I use to counter redzone aoes.

Btw I already mention all of this on my other posts I just repeat it to answer ur questions.

 

A little bit of everything is why i say it has no purpose. Okay it's rude to say but "having a little bit of everything" is sooo newbie way to play >.> ur damge is consistent LOW damage, I don't see any utility in it, and survive with luck.

Even with boosted CDmg, Spiining slash is stronger than Twin Slash. If you say fast, again it's fast but sloww.
You can use tempest if u want to go DPS, it's not long animation and u can move and attack while the tempest still spinning. for animation u have SWIFT and Trigger Slash for animation boost (Phantom Swift hits harder than twin slash anyway)

Getting aggro and tank if ur party only mage and sneak attack sniper? u'll never take aggro from swordfu and 2h. that breaker combo also produce low break power .-.

Okay sorry if I'm too straight forward but it's me >.>

If u want to see a utility that move fast, can deal higher damage, greater aggro come with me

And again..... plan ur purpose, focus on 1 thing. if u try to do everything u'll end up make nothing.

 

What they mean is, what sets your dw apart?
Mine is the Sustain, High HP partnered with High MP and AMPR.
Cella goes the aggro hog route.
Ash goes the DPS by consistency route.

What sets yours apart?
Although mine can be attained by many players. Only few have succeeded. Most who have tried transitioned to pure DPS.

 

@Cella
I thought what u said is just too funny coz I think ur just being bias. It just ur own preference in game & of course I also had mine.

In my thought focusing with just one thing will make u stronger/strongest on that specific thing but will result on having too many weaknesses.

Survive with luck?? With just having a good timing using skills/combos or playstye I can clearly survive, thats what u call luck.

And about changing my skills it will beat my purpose. And, I never know that having a balance build is for newbie & does not really a purpose because someone had a different idea about it.

 

@Cypherian
I think that the thing that set apart my build into others. Is wanting a balance build that can do it all dps, speed, utility, survival & etc. Im aware its lacking for now but it will remained as my purpose & idea.

"Someone who does a little bit of everything, yet does it extremely well."

 

Hmm .. Gearset wise, I can tell that you're attempting to transition into a pure DPS DW considering the fact that you least prioritize your potential innate survivability for more MP to try and spam more of your 1mp combo. That's a risky route, not just for you, but also for your party members too.

SG is good too. Actually, my previous special gear is Dex talisman II + Eerie which gives me +13 AMPR. This is my ring UNTIL talisman III series came out. I'm now using the same ring as you do. (Dex talisman III + SG which gives me +10 AMPR, more attacks and a CDMG%.)

in additional gear, you boost your crit ratio even further (Skull cape +10 crit rate +1AMPR. Warmonger +6 crit rate +2 crit damage) in exchange of Utility (AMPR/MP/HP) or +Damage route. I can clearly see what you're trying to do. I'll discuss it later. Ok let's proceed.

In your sword and armor .. You sacrificed your potential innate +22 flat critical damage and two +11% critical ratio stats in exchange of having two +7% critical damage/+7% attack and +7% critical damage. In my opinion, A7% CD7% Crate11 is not optimal to use especially for a player who doesn't max/prioritize STR stats. It's still bad even in 100 STR. (I'm a 100 STR user too.) the reason is, you're flat CDMG is still really really low for 100 STR so the multiplier that you can get from these two 7% CDMG will still be really really low.

In sword xtal, Pillar golem is your best balanced xtal. Best for DW that has hybrid stats distribution (utility/damage wise), ganglef for pure dex (safe xtal for pure dex) and Black knight for pure str (risky xtal because of its -9% def. This xtal is clearly a test for your way of thinking, a test between being greedy and a balanced players. This xtal is a WTF xtal for me.)

in your armor xtal, hmm .. I just wanna say this first .. Gear choices and xtal choices in 1 full build should blend with each other to truly create balanced base build overall. What I mean is, It's ok to sacrifice something if you think that it's better that way just as long as there's something that will fill the gap. Don't let it bleed longer enough. stop the bleeding ASAP. Silver roar/Jade raptor for a 1slot armor is good in a very specific gear setup. You will use this armor setup IF you're willing to equip Forehead protector/hero scarf/your preferred HP gear with Silver roar/your preferred xtal. this works best for silver roars tho. Why? +1,500 HP +16 AMPR is so good that even if your HP will be reduced by two -8% HP, you'll still be very very tanky. This is my gear setup back then. (my ideal starting gearset, best base gear+xtal setup in my personal preferences.) we can call this kind of setup a "Shortcut for optimal budget gearset." You can figure out your own gearset using the mindset that I used in this kind of setup.

Ok so .. Overall, back to your build (gearset wise) I can clearly see that you're really relying on your Twin slash by just looking at how you prioritize stats. (crit ratio, CDMG, base DEX = attack stats and the rest for STR = CDMG again.) what I said is all sincerely true and also, I wanna point this one out, "You're boosting Twin slash's potential by equipping crit rate equipments, using combo that can boost the critical ratio % of your twin slash by the use of shadowstep, that's cool I respect that but .. If you're gonna sacrifice some important stats in exchange of maximizing twin slash, why not use a 150% twin slash combo? I mean .. 90% is even lower than its normal damage output. And spamming a 90% twin slash alone, is not optimal at all. Your spinning slash might do more damage than the skill that you spend a alot of time/effort/spina with."

 

@Szchev`
Tnx for the suggestion. The reason of my combos & equipments is not really to maximize Twin damage. About the crit rate gears it will boost all the skills damage not only for twin, after using Astute it can went up to 93% crit rate. The consistent damage is from having most of the skills/autos to crits & for using quick motion boosting combo for the speed. The main reason of having Shadow on the second slot of the combo is to quickly reposition myself if theres a front/linear aoes & the crit buff for twin is just a side effect. I already said it Im abusing the use of shadow to ensure survivability. The reason of having Str is not for Dps I just thought I will benefit more on it rather than getting Agi. I already said it on my other posts why I think I wont use Agi. If I will go Dps I can just get phantom/tempest but I need to use longer combos or get impact for a second combo or more MP to do that. It will affect my playstyle but I considered ur opinions about it.

 

sigh................ okay.... I guess my suggestion is almost the same like others. go ahead with ur way

 

Hmm.. By reading your first previous replies/posts, and now comparing it all to your new replies/posts, it confuses me somehow in a sense of like .. hmm .. I don't know. It just felt .. Forced.

Ok so I will respect that one again. Hmm .. "You said your build's purpose" is about "Balance", I think this one right here (The balanced part) contradicts build in a sense of sacrificing one of the most important stats defensive-wise. That sacrificed stats alone defeats "your said purpose."

Also, you said that your main source of damage is Twin slash but your combo doesn't prove any point of stress offensively towards that said damage source that's why I'm a bit confused. (your spinning slash might do stronger damage output than your 90% twin slash.)

And, you said that your crit ratio's purpose was not to boost the potential of your twin slash but to stabilize overall damage output including autos & skills and you also said that you're spamming your 1MP combo with 90% twin slash combo with only 1 auto cancel in between. It obviously contradicts with each other to be honest, your spinning slash sometimes deals stronger damage output than your 90% twin slash skill. that one right there also strengthens the fact that your build don't have any main damage source or purpose playstyle wise. Just in a pure "ok" state except for your innate HP.

 

I said the same thing over and over again.......................
see bryan? everyone stating the word "purpose" sigh.... it's not like im forcing my thought to u, everyone think the same

 

@Szchev`
Of course I had the same thought about the added survival of Agi stat but if I can survive without having Flee/Dodge & Str can be more beneficial why not get it instead.

About Twin, I dont said that my crit gears purpose is not to boost twin what I said/mean is not ONLY for twin but for all the skills & auto.

 

@Cella
Purpose the reason for which something is done or created or for which something exists. And someone's intention or objective.

I dont know why my own reason on making my build is not a valid purpose.

My purpose is to had a balance build that will make all my strengths equally stronger to fill what Im lacking or my weaknesses. I had many purpose/objective in making my build like dps, speed, survival, utility & etc.
I knew that my build doesnt excel on any of it but it gives me no limitation on how can I improved my build.

Who make the rules that u only had to focus on just one thing on making a build like being pure DPS, Tank, Breaker & etc.

 

Guys you need to chill lol. IMO the most important thing about a build is if you're having fun using it or not, so if someone prefers a "jack of all trades, master of none" build we should respect his choice and play style preferences