4 new skills for Knight Skills tree.

according to coryn, it does.

 

Tested forefist at bkod and at shampy.

At Bkod, it does reduce damage but only once, after that, you're on your own for the rest of attacks.

At Shampy, it reduces all the wave attack damage to 1.

I think the change to the skill refers to a hidden buff which activates for a few split seconds when damage is received.

This is still pretty good. Going to be annoying to work into a counter combo given how slow knux skills are without 10k aspd. Or maybe it'll work best as an opener?

Welp, to the skill combo drawing board.

The damage is pretty low tho. Rush on save tag does more than this skill with no tags. Same time, rush is a lv4 skill and forefist is a lv1.

 

Idk who you're talking to with this, but I don't think I was glorifying 1hs here. All I did was analyzing stuff.
And isn't it obvious that everything has their own demerits? It's just that theoretically, knux seems to have more demerits compared to other weapons: less atk growth from basic stats, slow animation, low watk, short attack range, etc... And that led to people whining about it.
Idk why you so in love with accusing people like that.
Like you said, you "did not say knux doesn't have problems", others also didn't say there is no problem with this and that and everything and all either. That doesn't mean the problems doesn't exist, though, they just haven't talked about it yet.
Or have they?

Nobody is ignoring the penalties though. I think it's more like they decided to deem the penalties as "acceptable".
As I said, it's people's choice, preference, way of thinking. It's the matter of "Is the benefit worth the penalty? Yes or no?" and what does one think about it.
Perhaps other people may be "trying too hard to ignore penalties", but not me. I don't use those 2 on my tanks. I don't have enough damage reduction to make the def/mdef penalty ignore-able for me, and I mainly play bowgun tank so I don't really need ampr that much either.
Love how you like to generalize everyone.

I don't know how you can come to that conclusion with me only saying "aso favors 1hs a lot (like bow)". That meant "aso favors 1hs like how aso favors bow", like "they love this just like they love that". There is nothing in it saying "1hs is similar to bow" like you assumed.
And yes I have seen the penalties that bow & bowgun faced. They actually have several downsides if I compare them to other weapons, like lack of crit buff, "reliable" invincibility (until the arrival of Soul Hunter), ampr buff (although decoy compensated for this), lower watk, lower stability without arrow, skills being not as spammable as others,... But in exchange, they have their own advantages (range, damage burst, armor break, pierce,...).

Yes, I have. I main them, actually. And I've seen all kinds of problem they can have with different ways of build. Had to consider a lot on my own builds because of that.

Like I said above, people's preference, way of thinking, etc... "Do the benefits worth the penalties?" Yes? Use it. No? Don't then.

 

Yeah.
But I think for a tank, the dizzy chance from mb is more like "extra reward" rather than being the actual purpose. 1hs tank usually leaves it at lv1 and use it mainly for invincibility after all.
Well, quite a hefty skill for such "reward".

 

Oh and I forgot about this.
Penalties still mean something, actually, if it affects the performance in a bad way. Depending on what kind of penalties, that is, and are they bad enough or not.
Example, many people uses Brave Aura despite the accuracy penalty, because Toram formulae sucks, and high diff bosses have too much flee that makes player's accuracy almost irrelevant in most situation. Like, "why should I care about accuracy if I'm just gonna miss/graze anyway?" or some sort.
On the other hand, not many people uses High Cycle or Quick Motion on their physical dps because the ampr penalty is painful enough to make them avoid those despite the "massive" buff in aspd and cspd. Mages, however, doesn't care about that, since they don't rely on ampr to recover MP like those, therefore such penalties mean nothing to them.

 

It's pointless to argue with him regarding tanks, he already said he doesn't have tanking experience lol, so he doesn't know the important aspects of tanking or the many advantages of ohs compared to knuckle at the current update. Though if the tumble cooldown for sonic thrust remains then knuckle tanks will still have a use for certain high difficulty bosses, that's pretty much the only advantage knuckle tanks have at the moment, but since most boss runs with a competent party usually last less than or around 1 minute, you barely need to use tumble twice, meaning on most boss fights ohs tank is already superior if they don't need to tumble repeatedly for a long time.

 

You destroy proration for physical/magic dps by SPAMMING physical or magic skills several times, an ohs tank only need to use meteor breaker ONCE or TWICE every minute to maintain dizzy ailment on boss, and it's immediately fixed by a single auto-attack, so your argument about meteor destroying proration is invalid. Also there's very few mages with light ele staff to inflict the dizzy ailment for the party, while any ohs can do it regardless of their weapon element. So ohs tank is more convenient.

Not to mention meteor breaker has INVINCIBILITY which is easy to use to avoid absolute ailment attacks, as well as generate a lot of AGGRO at the same time, a knuckle tank can only use soul hunter for invincibility and it's very hard to time the invincibility.

So in my opinion, for new players who wants to make a tank character using only one character slot, then it's better if they just make an ohs tank, and once they reach a high level, they can easily get smash and sonic wave skill and switch to knuckle tank if they want to tank the SPECIAL few bosses that needs constant tumble with short cooldown. That's the state of things with the current update.

 

Wait, magic javalin gives invincibility?

 

Meteor breaker is unreliable because it can itself miss and get evaded in the first place.
Even though it's obvious that such puny skill like magic javalin can perform better than meteor breaker when it comes to inflicting dizzy.
You are yet trying hard to justify why meteor is better choice.
Invincibility because it's a close combat skill.
That's not something to worry about in range.
That's why bow types are so OP, even without invincibility.
Your hypocrisy is showing.

Looks like someone is hurt because of puny skill like magic javalin doing a better job of inflicting dizzy than meteor breaker. Lol
You made your own argument invalid by yourself.
Thanks for the laugh.

 

Forefist punch, I can work into a 3mp smite combo but the damage is atrociously bad. It's the kind of bad that makes it better to spam no combo rush or no combo triple kick instead.

It is good for high dodge, high eva, high crt resis targets but in those cases, the damage is too small to be meaningful and whatever damage gets through from other skills is 10x worth it than spamming forefist combo

 

We are arguing which is better, OHS tank or Knuckle tank, and you're bringing up Javelin from MAGIC skill tree? You make no sense.

Besides tumble skill, which skills does knuckle tank have that OHS tank can't have or have something better? THAT is the question.

 

Ngl you don't seem to be trying to have a proper conversation at all, instead only want to mock other people or be unnecessarily sarcastic or something.
Chill, bro. Be more polite, and try to talk like a normal person. Perhaps those guys will also do the same.

Anyway, yeah javelin does a better job on inflicting dizzy. It's magic so it cannot miss or be evaded, thus can guarantee the ailment. You need to have a md (main or sub) and light ele on weapon, though.
But well, there are several factors that need to be considered during a boss fight.
Mages are just too busy spamming finale or mburst to ensure the damage.
Magic warrior builds can utilize espell, but auto spells don't receive weapon bonuses so you're stuck with non-100%-ailment-chance auto mjavelin.
One can spare a few sec to cast the skill themselves, but Idk if there would be anyone who wants to spend their time doing so.
Then again, it's more like a "side bonus" for tank anyway. We can always have some dps 1hs/2hs users in the party spamming mb like there's no tomorrow and there'll be dizzy inflicted at some point, or some "support" mage doing it for you (if there is any).
And beside, as you said, javelin is "puny" skill. And during these day people would prefer super mega stronk skills with high damage and pierce and stuff than using those "puny" skills unless they can provide enough benefit that can outweigh the "puniness".

 

It's not like I'm even saying that knuckles is straight up useless lol, ever since I found out and tested myself that sonic thrust does indeed have longer cooldown than sonic wave, I'm also convinced that knuckle tank is still useful on special bosses like volgagon and I even mentioned that I'll keep my knuckle tank weapon so my ohs tank can switch to it when tanking those special bosses, and use my ohs tank on 99% of the bosses. I don't know what his problem was.

 

I wasn't even talking about tumble anymore, 1hs is bad at it, that's already clear
I was talking about berserk and rampage penalty. Lol
And who was making fuss about dizzy?
So I mentioned magic javelin doing a better job for dizzy despite being a puny lvl 1 skill, that triggered some people.

So in conclusion 1hs remains an incomplete tank with good amount of penalties.
I won't say knuckle is better, because it got its own problems, which are not same as 1hs.

So don't say nonsense like 1hs is superior.
Totally shows how much of a hypocrite you are.

 

Um... Iirc they were arguing about 1hs vs knux comparison, so you bringing javelin in is kinda offtopic.

1hs actually is superior in a sense, though, general speaking. Not 100% superior, but overall better. On tanks, at least.
I mean, does knux have any i-frame skill other than Soul Hunter? Does knux have "reliable" and easy-to-maintain crit buff or ampr buff or stuff? Anything that ohs can't do or have? And a few more questions.
Well, other than the interruptions, there might be one or two other advantages of knux tank that idk of.

Btw you seem to love the word "hypocrite". Are you sure they really are hypocrites?

 

everyone comparing sonic thrust vs wave which is better

meanwhile every dps spam impact

 

Real chads use all three.

 

1hs better as tank? Lol
Name one skill of 1hs that increases defence.
Instead it has skills that decreases its defence ability.
You are bragging so much about its buff, whatever perks it gives.
And at what cost?
It's defence ability.
And you call it better? Lol
Knuckle on the other hand has skills that increases defence.
Knuckle does not have skills that decreases it's defence abilities.
While even has skill that effects party members and increases defence capabilities.
1hs has none of those.
And 1hs is better as a tank?
With 1hs you are a lone tanker, while knuckle is quite opposite.

Come now man.
That's laughing stock worthy.

 

did you even try playing both ohs vs knux tank in the first place?

when did knux got exclusive defensive buffer?(dont even try consider chakra as defense buffer because its only once per use and hassle to recast)

ohs even have exclusive defense buffer (knight stance 10% frac resist)

also it seems you pretty butthurt on 250 def/mdef which is pretty low sacrifice if you have something like 100 both phy/res and B+ set defensive eqs

phy/mag resistance dmg reduction comparison
with def/mdef 250 = 87.8%
without def/mdef 250 = 84.75%

in a cost of 3.05% dmg reduct you would gain perks of this
100% aspd , 1000 aspd
25 ampr
1000 aggro buff generator combo

this is only utility comparison (if ohs goes knight path is not even comparable anymore)

 

You do know that way cry is all weapon skill right? Lol