Its worth to be MTL?

Hi, Main TANK here
Im asking you all if its worth to be a MTL tank in Toram any more, i mean ALL NEW EVENT BOSSES bypass MTL even reaching 110%
This event Boss MIELI have me eaten all his Stats ailment, stun, flinch, slow, drag... etc... previous Boss events same! so why waste 255 points on a worthless stat and have lame equipment for a mechanic that don't works any more?
What do you think guys? free resets are up and im almost convince to switch to a VIT>DEX DPS tank

 

That's the point if I'm going to avoid all damage in high difficult event bosses because "Absolut ailments" why use MTL at all? Instead I can have 255 on Dex, and use Revenier and my armor can have better stats. I don't know, why Asobimo creates a mechanic to just throw it like trash.

 

Because it's better to have most, or at least half, of the ailments thrown into your face be negated, than having all of them thrown into your face.
It's like vaccination. It's better to have most diseases be prevented than catching several ones at once.
Edit: and also it's not like every bosses are gonna throw absolute ailment 24/7

 

Why not just make 2 tank characters. 1 for 255 MTL and the other a DEX/AGI + VIT tank.

97% or higher of the content you'll interact with benefits from having MTL as a tank. The other outliers are good for non-MTL offshoots, but aren't so much better that you'd even need another stat build to consider conqueing them.

Regardless of what you do though, it still comes down to avoiding those ailments strategically. If you can't avoid them, then there's no benefit to either build, since your bonus damage won't do anything if your constantly stunned/tumbled or fearing for your life.

All in all. Git guud.

 

Yea i get it, but come on you waste 255 stat points on something "useless" and make your set +25% MTL sacrificing better stats just for a mechanic being obsolete? also there is a skill in knight tree which becomes obsolete by this "Fareth"

That's the point of wasting 255 stats to become "inmune" to ailments no other clase beside tank and mages can use MTL (and even mages trash the MTL build for being obsolete)
My current MTL tank is Light armor, Vit MTL using evasion to avoid boss AOE, perfect defenece and so on, but still i feel like im wasting stats on MTL if all event bosses bypass ailment resistance, its like, what is the point of it any way, if i can just evade the attack's and P.Deff or Backstep my way out of a trouble, like normally do and have up Recovery if i "get hit" by a tricky ailment... its like having Water clone, and all bosses now likes to make trips all over te place, and to recover mana you just use high AMPR and Basic AA instead of the clone.

I don't want to have 2 Tanks i used to and reset one to be a DPS may years ago xD

TLDR:
Keep MTL (And feel like a waste of potential)
Switch to VIT>DEX (And have decent damage)

 

Main tanks wouldn't ask such a du- strange question. The point of full MTL ailm.res. tanks was to live longer, dont be stunned/lying face down on the ground, etc., when you want to use pdef or disabling a boss for breaking parts or in the middle of casting an important combo. It's your choice to build a tras- semi-tank-diepees but then you're kinda...ded? +Your damage output is...sh-
Point is, this isn't dota, so you're either a diepees or a tank, others are for fun currently and probably much wont change with the addition of T5. I mean, if you're barely surviving a boss on full vit and mtl, how will dex help you live longer? Damage? You need to ask diepees first, if they want a semi-tank in party or a normal one, cuz they'll die more then.

 

I'll just say it all depends on what you want to do with your character. I'd recommend try testing a dps tank on a alt or new character first tbh.

VIT-MTL imo is still worth it, since it negates everything except absolute ailments. Without it, you're more susceptible to a lot more ailments/CCs. Unless there's absolute ailments, MTL really helps us the most stay stationary. Only a few bosses have absolute ailments thankfully, and they can usually be easily dodged or i-framed. That said, I haven't faced the newest difficulty of Miele so I'm not sure it's the same situation.

A "dps tank" IS possible, just know you're less flexible. You would be reliant on blocking(It can give 100% resistance) or using I-frames to stay stationary. There's just a few problems:
1: You can't use any skills until you stop blocking.
2: It can't block certain attacks and absolute ailments(of course).
3: If you have Armor(?) Break, you can't block anymore.
4: If Guard goes below 100, you'll be susceptible to ailments.
Without this, you're just as susceptible to ailments as everyone else. So compared to VIT-MTL, it's harder to tank well.
Edit: IMO, in order to be a "dps tank", you would have to forsake VIT and MTL. Otherwise you won't have good enough dps. With resistance equipment, large hp, and certain skills, you can actually still tank pretty well for some bosses. I'm leveling a Dex-Str Paladin so far, & I can tank pretty well so far.

 

Looks like a lot of TORAM players don't know how to do other kind of tanks or have never play another mmorpg, like other games WOW, AION Etc etc, tanks have variety and don't need to do the AILMENT RES shit.
Just reached the final cap boss... nice another MTL By passing boss... wow this crappy design of bosses is lame, i mean ok Fractional damage to low tank hp ok cool but now DPS can have 1hp to be inmune to damage... such creativity...
I have another build in mind and even play it, but still some time to time a boss just going to have a skill to push tanks out the map like P.Chan
VIT>DEX increase revenier damage and Shield canon, also survability is the same, i don't use guard, a lot of the time boses just use AOE spikes and guard is useless vs floor damage so P.Def backsteep to safety or just use evasion o wait you cant, you just have a "Perfect ailment slow"
So yea i open this pool to know if its still wort to have MTL not to know y players don't know how to use other builds

 

The problem is that not every bosses has absolute ailment/can bypass MTL, and not every ailment that a boss can inflict are absolute ailment. And this is Toram, not WOW AION etc etc. It would've been much nicer if Toram tanks can be similar to tanks of other games, but unfortunately Toram is Toram.

Toram used to "promote creativity" but lately monotonous builds are being favored more and works more efficient than hybrid ones. Unlike other games, most hybrid builds in Toram aren't good enough, only average at best. Like your case, VIT>DEX semi tank is an interesting build with maybe decent damage and survivability, but of course it cannot be as good a pure dps or pure tank. Since you have no STR (which is the core of the current STR Online), you'll be lacking crit damage along with lower ATK than STR>DEX or DEX>STR dps builds; and since you have no MTL, you'll be more vulnerable to ailments than MTL tanks. Sure if the boss has absolute ailment then there might not be much difference, but again, "not every bosses has absolute ailment, and not every ailment that a boss can inflict are absolute ailment".

"ok Fractional damage to low tank hp ok cool but now DPS can have 1hp to be inmune to damage... such creativity..." you say. Fractional damage is damage based on percentage of HP so of course that is one way to deal with it. Players always find a way to deal with problems of a game so that ain't nothing serious. And afaik that kind of damage has been around for ages. What's the problem with it? It hurts so much so it must be crappy design or something? Then what are the movement keys and guard/parry skills for? Dancing? This is Toram, not WOW AION etc etc. The game design itself is already different.

"tanks have variety and don't need to do the AILMENT RES shit" well there are different kinds of tanks, yes, and each of them may functions differently from the others. As you said, there's that thing called "variety". And because of that, you don't expect different style of the same "class/build type" to do exactly the same as each other. You don't expect a high hp shield tank to take high frac damage head-on, or a barehand tank to guarantee fts on the target. You don't expect a tank that doesn't mind taking ailments to do the same as a tank that does. You don't expect a tank that deals against bosses with few to none absolute ailments to be the same as a tank that is for bosses with lots of absolute ailments. Just because some bosses can inflict some absolute ailments doesn't mean you can disregard everything else. If you think MTL is worthless now that some bosses can inflict like, idk, two or three absolute ailments for their entire life, then go ahead, just do as you like, nobody can stop you if you really want to do so that bad. But don't complain if you were to bring your "tank" to a boss that inflicts non-absolute burn or poison and see your hp drops like stock market on crisis. Oh, and don't forget about those non-absolute flinch tumble stun stop slow sleep paralyze freeze etc etc.

One more thing: the Event bosses are called "event bosses" for a reason. They don't stay forever. Well, unless your tank is completely exclusive for event bosses only. Like the other guy said, you can make two tank characters, one with MTL and one without. Also, until every ailments that a boss can inflict are absolute ailment (or at least the most annoying ones are), MTL is not obsolete yet. Calling it obsolete right now is like calling crit rate obsolete because some bosses have crit resist. If you dislike MTL stat and absolute ailments that much but don't want to make 2 tanks then don't cry when you get whacked by the ailments that you should have been able to avoid.

[Sick] is another thing, though. That stupid ailment cuts your ail res by half so even MTL tank will have a hard time with it. In that case you either avoid getting it beforehand or cleanse it. Still, having some ail res remain is still better than having zero from the start. At least with the former you can still have a chance to avoid non-absolute ailments, which are still the majority of the ailments bosses inflict on you atm.

Edit:
Oh and I forgot. Semi tank isn't that bad, but it's not for every situation. Sure, some additional damage is nice and all, but you should consider a few other factors.
Proration is one of those, as most dps builds are physical damage dealer which rely on physical proration. Although it might not be that much of a problem since many people now use Soul Hunter for damage, and Revenir doesn't affect proration.
Another thing is your own survival as a tank. If you're a tank, and especially is the only one in your party, you'll need to stay alive and draw all aggro on you so that the other damage dealers can finish the boss. If you die, your entire party will die. There's no point of getting some more damage if you are to die before the boss is killed.

 

Finally some one who knows
Besides i don't say fractional dmg is "bad" the bad part is the abuse, those new fancy bosses are a joke when a DPS have 1hp and didn't resive any damage from frack DMG, and as a tank now doesn't mater how many HP or M/P RES you have you always going to recibe absurd amount of damage, i mean i was testing 20,000 hp (100 VIT) vs 60,000 (Full VIT -255) its not difference at being hit by frac or damaged by bosses, what im doing now is just not being hit by enemies use evasion to avoid AOE and just use P.Def to maintain aggro or avoid a unebitable damage, thanks to the fact all bosses i encountered recently bypass MTL.

I know TORAM is just a old Mobil MMORPG but cmon, im not the only one feeling like a waste of potential using MTL and it dont working as "intended" i only have MTL to do events like P.Chan or the last anniversary were bosses pushes you out (And even they had MTL bypass)
A wile ago just before LV150 skills were even mentioned i use to have a AGI>VIT knuckle tank (Manual evation or guard was inexistent, but manage to have cap evation and a lot of flee ), was fun to play but due bosses like Titeress pushing you out the field or the first time P.Chan Arrives to toram, then i decide to swich to MTL and was ok for a time until the new trend of unavoidable ailments arrived. Insted of new ailments to justified the forced effect why no create new like the "Stone" on Hiden Pillow boss? or at leas if you have MTL Forsed ailments take less time to end, but no, here, have an ailment like you dont have waste 255 points and equipment for MTL

 

Yes, because as far as I know, there is no boss that has all of their ailments as absolute ailment. I tried your idea once about 6 months ago, and I regret it deeply. I thought those burn, sick, poison, etc at hero potum makes MTL pointless. I was wrong. I got flinched, knock-backed, tumbled, and stunned like a ragdoll. Usually, only some of those motion lock are absolute ailment, paired with others which are not. Those type of bosses is where knuckle tank shines more than OHS tank, since knuckle gains a lot more aspd from AGI than OHS (also, 2 more evasion charge is always welcome). By using berserk, and adding 200 pts to AGI while trying to keep my HP at 30K at least, I can have lots of aspd to give me enough motion to dodge those attacks. Also, this tank is also quite good against fractional damage spammer boss. By adding MTL to this kind of build, it helps to ignore some of the motion locking skills of the bosses.



P.S. 255 MTL is not necessary if you are lucky with your ava stat. Eqs also help. I myself am currently only using 200pts of MTL.

 

I would add a passive that deny tumble,flinch etc if you have heavy armor equipped.It cant deny Magic flinch tho.

 

most of the ailments can be blocked by registlet, if you know the attacks from the boss then just guard the flinch, tumble and stun
my tank is VIT>STR with full tank equip (light armor) and i can play like a normal tank, i use binding strike with blood sucker to recover all hp if i need and i can do dmg with revenir, but its not easy to use dmg skill while you are trying to survive, my aggro is okay, one aggro combo holds for 2m~

 

AGI>VIT is a little hard to play, but was fun in the time, manage to tank all bosses no problem, except P.Chan when she pushed you away even whit p.Defense
Mi current build have a lot of motion speed, to evade AOE and cast skills fast to control or maintain aggro or just to generate mana by AA, and range attack (8mt) for those AOE protected bosses

Yes as i said i don't decide yet if swich to DEX>VIT tank (Dex hives you hit, increase revenier damage and can help vs crit res bosses) or stay like VIT>MTL (I mean i don't just stay still to eat all damage like a free buffet, and guard dont protects you vs floor damage, damage a lot of bosses spam now)

Plus in theory some nice skills are useless by the game mechanics, Why use heavy armor if light armor is far better to evade all damage? Guard is cool vs old bosses but all new bosses forces you to move aside or get killed or just use p.Def and jump back, or use Elegant Poise, Fareth is 10sp wasted if you need to move constantly to avoid standing still in a frac AOE

 

I got a tank vit smith bro I would like that stats wouldnt mind in smithing

 

i used to have one to, but Smith Tank is only for normal quest and history bosses, not for events i know is boring to have more than 50 skill points lost due smith, but that's the price for a chance of +2 slot gear

 

Not going to tell people how to do their builds but ill give my 2 cents.......

If u can tank without ail resist cuddos to you, ail resist is important flinch,tumble,stun Ruins your smooth function as a tank. Poison and burn by passes all your resist and has you the boss mercy. So for me blocking these are important.

As for absolutes are concerned they are minor annoyances than can be worked around with some skill. Take note even when a boss has absolute ailments they also have a wide range of other ailments you don't feel because of your resistance to them, so it still works for you, you just didn't realize .

As for fracs, there is no one build fits all so I personally have barehand for frac heavy bosses where cc isn't needed .

Back on topic ailment resistance is important, so important to me that my vit>tec build has 100%ail resist, since I hate being influenced with annoying ailments.

Trying to adopt dps into a rank will just make it a trashy dps and putting you as a tank into unnecessary risk, being locked in a combo can kill u and ruin the run.

 

As a tank DPS its not like you throw your tank duties away, you just complement damage, you never going to win DPS in a party focusing on farming Event bosses, but you can help kill it faster. In my case i play whit my wife (Mage) and i need to do Physical DMG to help farming bosses (In those forgotten bosses were no player was seen again farming it again after MQ) and kill the trash moobs chasing her after finale scratches them (Farming minibosses)

So again, in my personal opinion, im not a huge fan of have a "mechanic" ignored just for lazy game devs "implementing" "New stuff"

 

Ok , you if you have proper global aggro mobs won't be an issue for her. Secondly of u want to tank and dps a boss and its not dmg heavy just make a knuckle paladin with dx knuckles if you have it.

Dx devil dango, Ghoulfish buckler, christmas tree with gordo, 1s/2s full crt garb uing goph and if 2s add dx. machina ring with volg , 2nd clot optional but u can use patissa for ampr.

Or do the smart thing, tell her to forget mage , the devs dont do mage justice and its a crappy dps build.

 

I have proper global aggro, but as you can guest finale is a high mana spell so scratching a enemy will hive it that many aggro, also i just cast a combo and kill them whit Binding Strike.
Imposible, she just want to play as mage, also hates Asobimo to fot letting mages forgotten (Maybe i convince her to use Nemesis, is a work in progres)