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What is Decent Damage/How to Do Damage? and the Absence of Quality of Life "Features"

Discussion in 'Toram Online General Discussions' started by Wolf King, Jul 21, 2021 at 5:34 PM.

  1. Wolf King

    Wolf King Well-Known Member

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    I thought i knew but I don't. I've been playing off/on for years now and every time I come back, it's always the same story. Stumble around, Research, Grind, Make 1 leap forward, Stumble, Quit, Come back.

    Last time I came back, I made a huge jump. Finally got to Lvl 150 (? Wherever the t4 skill unlock is). Noticeable increase in damage, from 10k to like 40-70k. Found a decent way to make money that I was okay with provided the economy didnt flash it's ugly ass. It was good... but the stumble was leveling became increasingly difficult and the damage I was doing got less and less as the difficulty for everything went up. So... I quit, well... went on "hiatus with no clear intention of coming back" tho at least this time i didnt uninstall the game.

    I come back almost a year later, see new skill for my build. Nice. See they do massive damage. Nice. Research, make sure I know and understand how they work. Nice. Grind story to lvl up to 180. Nice. Get the skills. Nice. And...

    I do no damage to these higher difficulty bosses...

    Maybe it's gear? I just need to upgrade my gear? Xtal here, Xtal there, and maybe i'll do more damage? Nope. All those stat points I been saving to make sure I dont waste them on the wrong thing, maybe it's time to cash those in? Alright.... Nope.

    So here I am once again. Broke. No Stat Points, no Skill Points, takes forever to level and I do no damage so it takes a bit more than forever. I just don't understand this game's progression despite having played for at least a year and a half in "true time" (days/hours wise).

    It takes me 20-30 minutes to beat (Nightmare) Iconos. And the highest I hit it is 30-40k.
    But I go back to Don Yeti and do 100k-180k

    I farmed (Nightmare) Venana and felt like I did no damage. So I just relegate myself to spamming auto attack, hoping that Im helping someone via proration but never being sure of that so ultimately feeling useless like a burden to the party.

    Build is Magic Swordsman (that I've been trying to build since before Magic Blade Skills were even a thing). I know it's not a "meta" dps class. I was never expecting to hit 1mil+ dps. Just to be able to clear NM/Ult bosses and sub-bosses in a reasonable amount of time. Just to feel like I can at least help boost a party's dps to the point where I'm not entirely useless.

    That brings me to the Quality of Life "Features" I think they should add...

    A.) Show the "Hidden" Stats of Player on the Character Screen - It makes no sense why there isn't a "more/advanced details" button that shows you all the stats of your character that come into play and explain what they do. I know what they all are/do now... but in hindsight, it should just be in the game. For convenience's sake, just because it should be, because it makes no sense for it not to be, and there's no reason it isn't.


    B.) Show the Bosses' Stats (and maybe abilities) - This is so dumb. Is there even a guide that shows the specific stats of Bosses? Why do you have to guess/eyeball how much Crit Rate you need just to be able to GRAZE a boss? At least show us it's Crit Resistance so we can know exactly how much Crit Rate we need to get past it. Show us how much Def/MDef it has, how much/many resistance it has, you know, important stuff that makes the difference between dealing 1 damage and 100k damage...


    C.) Release a Progression Guide/System - Probably the most controversial suggestion here... but speaking from my experience as an eternal noob at this game....it shouldn't be. And I don't think I'm the only one like me. For those of you who don't need it, fair enough. But there are some people who do. I need to know, what should I be doing now? What specific stat checkpoints I should be at for this point in my progression? What are the DPS milestones I should be hitting for a 1/3/5/10 minute clear time? "Just Farm for Spina/Gear/Levels" is not enough, but that seems to be the only guidance that people give. It tells me nothing about where I am or where I should be heading. Just something like "if you have XXXX Attack/Matk, XX Crit Chance, and XX Crit Damage you should be able to clear X Boss in X amount of time." and or "Use this as your Main DPS skill on Boss X and you should be doing X amount of damage at this point in your progression". I don't know. Just something that lets me and peopke like me know where we are via some kind of standard. A lot of games offer rewards along a Progression Path... I don't want the rewards, I just want the Progression Path.


    On my way back, I stumbled across the discussion of giving more Free Resets. I er on the side of more resets.... because once again, I've stumbled, and once again, I'm probably going to quit until there is one because my experience isn't exactly what I'd call "enjoyable" right now. Suffering through the "loop" of the game is one thing. I can do that, I've been doing it. But suffering through it, while knowing that it could go down the drain at the slightest tap of a mistake on the brittle glass of a character build, while already having made such mistakes and starting again several times.

    I'm not starting this build over from scratch. I'm not going to grind through an unenjoyable experience, for the CHANCE to grind through another unenjoyable experience for the CHANCE to grind through another unenjoyable experience all for the CHANCE to have an enjoyable experience...

    I know people are tired of the "Free Reset" discussion. But I'm bringing it up because to me, the options are: Give more Resets, Introduce a Progression Guide, or Quit the Game.

    And look, I know there's resources available and stuff to help mitigate mistakes but mistakes in builds will happen. Some people don't learn by watching/reading and listening. Some people can only learn by doing. And that's why I want something like a Progression Guide. Something that walks me through the process with me doing it.

    But yeah... that was a lot...


    I have nothing to measure/compare to so I don't know where I am. What is decent damage? Vs What Boss? Some guidance would be much appreciated.
     
  2. Argo

    Argo Well-Known Member

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    I'm in the same boat, although I do a bit more damage. Majority of my characters do around 100~300k with their main skill at lvl 150, but even that's peanuts against most of the bosses right now.

    I found upgrading the weapon did the most to boost my damage. Even without bothering with xtals, going to the blacksmith and making the strongest weapon there did a lot to up my dps. Didn't cost all too much either. Same with accessories, I find they help a lot, and as long as you don't worry about slots, they're all very affordable.

    Also if you really just want to do noticeable damage, you should try finale mage. I have a blacksmith-built yozakura crescent staff and a blacksmith-built magical stole, both of which have no slots, and I do over 1 mil damage with them. It's an easy character to use too, because at finale lvl 10 it has a decently short cast time, and if you manage to unlock lvl 3 guard skills, you can even evade while casting.
     
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2021 at 11:23 PM
  3. Wolf King

    Wolf King Well-Known Member

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    Thanks. I have a +B weapon with a cheap Xtal (Zolban i think). I'll try to get it to +S and see if that helps. Maybe try an npc weapon too.

    As for making a finale mage, that's not an option in my eyes. I wanna do decent damage while playing the character I wanna play with. If I'm not doing that, then there's no reason for me to be playing the game.
     
  4. Argo

    Argo Well-Known Member

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    Fair enough, I definitely recommend building npc items though, the new anniv weapons all have really good stats
     
  5. Razielle

    Razielle Well-Known Member

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    Well, ofc with +b weapon we can also guess the rest of your equip and thats why the dmg isnt that high.
    Youd want to consider looking for a cheap anniv5 2s +s, they shold be affordable these days. Then make/buy a 2s adv garb. As for add you can use a 1s +b that suits you more (a lot to choose from) and machina ring 2s with decent xtals.
    If youre a 2hs magic warrior, you should do decent damage, decent compared to meteor i guess. These days bosses are ruled by bow cf that do 2-5m dmg per crossfire (lol).
    And soul reaper (dark skill) 2hs/hb, these ones can easily do finstern ult in 30-40 seconds per run.
    With good eq and xtals you should still be able to dish out 500k-1m per combo?
    I mean, you do use combos, right?
     
  6. Wolf King

    Wolf King Well-Known Member

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    "Just Farm for Spina/Gear/Levels" is not enough, but that seems to be the only guidance that people give. It tells me nothing about where I am or where I should be heading."

    Im a 1hs+md

    What's considered "good" and against which bosses? 500k-1m damage against which bosses? What should my stats look like?
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2021 at 1:15 AM
  7. XGunZx

    XGunZx Member

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    who needs dmg when you can be tank? :D

    its a joke :v
    for farm just go get bird wing, its not much, but its good when you dont have any dmg
     
  8. Kaisyl

    Kaisyl Elite Member Elite Member

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    Oh ffs.

    Hey, as a 1h+MD, your damage type stats are from STR / INT (Primary STR).

    Your main damage may come from combining enchant sword and enchant burst.

    With your stat focus being STR which gives critical damage, you may need spell burst later on when you want to combo magics into your build.

    You will need the following skill trees mainly:
    - Blade (Close range DPS, mostly for sword tech and sword tempest)
    - Magic (Mostly for impact and magic burst tho burst is completely optional due to being weak and MP regen being a pain in this game)
    - Wizard (Mostly for the MATK boost and maybe imperial ray for ranged DPS)
    - Magic Warrior (Main skill tree)
    - Halberd (Option for punish ray and GSW)

    Reason for wizard skills is because they get damage boost from STR last I know of and imperial ray has guaranteed critical so it can get big damage bonus from STR main stat. It's ranged too so it's a keeper.

    You can use auto spell skill from lv4 magic warrior to rapidly build up proration though that works best for solo. In a team, proration flies all over the place.

    For equipment, when crafting, you can try to get STR and Critical stats on your gear then go for MATK if you can.

    To be quite honest, this build can work but it requires some combo setup that let's you create and close distances rapidly for casting magic and doing phys dps. In theory it can work amazingly well solo but may lag behind the God of DPS option, bow + arrow.
     
  9. Wolf King

    Wolf King Well-Known Member

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    Oof. Then I already fked up for that build. I put all my stats in STR, DEX, CRT (255/71/130). I've been piecing together/taking inspiration from other people's builds and some of the info/tips said go STR/DEX and at the time someone said have 130 CRT to get pass Crit Resistance.<If you're scrathing your head at the weird stats, wondering wtf I'm doing.

    E.Burst has been really enjoyable. Though even at max it doesnt do much more than E.Sword. Guessing that's because no INT? Have 1k Matk, 1300+ after E.Burst buff. So how much Matk should I have for doing decent Magic damage?

    Look at Spell Burst: noted

    For MP Recovery, I use Rampage+Berserk+Trigger Slash, and Resonance helps that too a bit. Idk how recommended that is but... yeah.

    The auto spell skill is nice. Though there are moments when I wish it was a toggle-able ability that I could turn on/off.


    For wizard, doesnt tht Familiar just die if it gets clipped by anything? On Coryn Club, it says it has 100% Damage Reduction? For itself? So it takes no damage if at lvl 10?


    And yeah. You just echoed the thoughts I had yesterday. It definitely lends itself to a more solo playstyle, which is ironic cuz im a solo player mostly, so for once a class I like in a game winded up fitting me lmao, even though it's still second/third/fourth/etc fiddle. Idk where it is overall. Speaking of distance management... yeah i need Shukuchi

    But yeah. If I can somehow will myself to do it, I'll make a new character to try that build.
     
  10. Wolf King

    Wolf King Well-Known Member

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    No not to me that ain't a joke. Sometimes I beat myself over the head wondering, "Why in the fk would I ever try being any sort of DPS in this mmo? As if I'm not gonna wind up being a tank/healer anyway?"
    LMAOOOOOO

    But yeah. I'm making a... not so tanky tank, to soak damage for me as a companion character. Would you happen to know how bad of an idea it is to rely on damage reduction from Crusher skills to tank? (assuming I'm playing the character. I would think having an npc character using those to tank is a clear, "just give them a shield" moment, right? Or is the ai smart enough to time them correctly?)
     
  11. mun1409

    mun1409 Well-Known Member

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    That 130 number ppl put up is the total crit rate. CRT stat is not one for one translated to crit rate. These day, most people get crit rate from combination of food buff (from friend or guildmate house), equipment (weapon, armor, additionals, xtal) and skill (berserk, crit up, meikyou).
     
  12. Kaisyl

    Kaisyl Elite Member Elite Member

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    The thing that makes sub magic classes bad is to deal decent magic damage, you need an obscene amount of MATK (4~5k?) Something that's tough even for mages to get and that's to deal decent dmg with finale.

    STR/DEX isn't bad if you use magic for proration and itility and focus on doing physical damage with meteor, buster and enchant sword.

    The CRT is a bit much but with that, you shouldn't need any CRT stat on equipment and can focus on STR/MATK/CDMG/CSPD
     
  13. Wolf King

    Wolf King Well-Known Member

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    True true. And yeah, I've been using magic mostly for proration. Before Magic Blade skill tree, the build concept was initially a "Damage Buffing Support via Proration".


    So what yall ate saying is, get rid of the CRT if given the chance? And go DEX or INT. Any points in CRT at all or just the cr from gear? Gear that specific (Str & Matk, etc) is basically/probably a pipe dream for me.
     
  14. Kaisyl

    Kaisyl Elite Member Elite Member

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    If you can't afford the equipment then honestly, it's fine until you can begin farming mobs/soloing bosses for it.

    If you're ok with the build as is with magic being proration mainly then give up on MATK and go ATK instead for your equipment focus. I honestly just remembered conversion but cannot remember if it converts ATK bonuses from equipment.

    So now it's STR/ATK/CDMG

    No need to obtain magic burst from the magic skill tree, just use wizard skills which have independent casting or just forgo that and use resonance/autospell. Imperial ray isn't so useful.

    Then you can also forgo spell burst.

    Doing all that just gets you a swordsman with really good proration though but your damage accumulates really quickly.
     
  15. Wolf King

    Wolf King Well-Known Member

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    That's all I can ask for at this point lmao

    I can only "solo" some higher level bosses on normal right now (given npc tanks to speed things up). Anything above 3 mil HP and Im dead. I'll try some sub-bosses to see how I do there.

    (Also, Conversion scales Matk based on Weapon Atk)
     

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