Why is Bow so much better?

I was just wondering, what makes Bow arrow builds' damage so much better than, say, Knuckles, for example?
While I understand that Decoy range and invincibility has a lot of contribution to MP management, what increases its damage?

• 5th anniv Bow VII has a base ATK of 196, whereas 5th anniv Knuckles has a base ATK of 228.
• The max ATK bow doesn't come close to max ATK knuckles, and they both have ATK 8% stats.
• While Bow has two extra ATK from stats, Knuckles has Annihilator.
• Crossfire at 3/3 has a multiplier around 27-30 and Goliath at 5/5 has a multiplier around 28 and take a similar time to charge.
• Crossfire at 5/5 has a multiplier around 45-50 and Goliath at 5/5 and GodHand 3/3 has a multiplier around 49, and one can probably get 3/3 Godhand in 17 sec.
• While Bow has Snipe for Armour break, Knuckles with high Motion speed can also reliably inflict Armour break.
• At a time (not anymore) CF wasn't affected by SRD/LRD.

The data shows that with similar other gear (and similar STR) Bow and Knuckles should trade blows in terms of Damage, or Knuckles should be at least a close second.
WHATS WRONG?

 

Satellite arrow with 100% physical pierce

 

While you're charging cf, satelite arrow is also doing a lot of damage. On top of 100% pierce, this skill also has 8-9+DEX/100 multiplier, so if all three arrows hit, its damage is greater than 3 charges cf, effectively doubling damage

 

Jst say bow is shiit to bow users they will tell u much more

 

Also sub element arrow gives +25% more dmg. Free element is just way too good.

 

You are forgetting the main issue. Look back at the game title. Yes, it's "Cross Fire Online".

 

Reasons are:
1.) I think Toram Team babysits their "ideal" pure offensive weapon class.
2.) As ppl said, free awaken element is OP and you won't bother to refine your sub weapon, even an atk+3% dagger is no match for an arrow with element and 1 base atk.
3.) Stability & Accuracy. IIRC, bow gains stab from both STR and DEX, making them consistent damage dealers in Normal-Hard (or even NM) difficulties. High accuracy = lesser chance to graze = consistency.
4.) Decoy. Their illusion is ranged and casts additional attacks of CF in ideal conditions.
5.) Crystas/Stats/Equipments. Player-statted equipments are mostly for full offensive risking defensive stats, also some crystas like Agela which also risks defensive stats.
6.) Their downsides are almost nothing (for me, at least). Equipping an arrow is -def/mdef (IIRC) the boss can't even touch you with nice manual evasions (can be also applied to -resistance stats e.g. Shaved Ice Hat) or having good tanks.
Low ASPD? just use Volgagon or drink Giga Speed Potion or use GSW/Quick Aura = NP.

 

Bow have
-100% PP Skill
-100% Armor Break
-Charging Skill that wont lock char
-Free Awake Element From Sub
-Unlimited MP
-Longest Range in the Game
-Very High Skill Rate and Constant
-One of Strongest DEX Weapon (High P.P in ulti and non graze in lower diff?)
-No Anti Range Boss
-Strongest AOE Attack

Knux have
-Shitty Armor Break Rate (they should remove Bonus cap the Shell Break Bonus from Enemy Def to encourage player spam until it proc)
-Shortest Range Weapon
-Lowest Growth from Stats
-AGI is useless due to GSW (Say Hello to Hyper Speed THS without AGI)
-Annihilator turn into more shitty CC/Ailment Rate (Armor Break from auto is useless now)
-Anti Melee Boss

 

I wonder why the dev don't even bother to buff Shellbreak to be reliable to cause armor break when the skill has the "break" word in its name

 

Bow is just over glorified...
There are bosses where bow sucks too...
All class may shine at certain bosses over the others

Knux has a sharp learning curve

The advantage with non gsw build is that you can trade blows if the hit won't kill you which adds up in long runs

Playing is not just all formula, cf charge is stopped when hit while knux can counter and is easier to charge for spammy bosses, down side is they need to get near to hit GP

Bow is just easier to learn, knux enthusiasts can keep up with bow dps, the same for other weapons... (Except md)

 

I agree with a lot of these posts. Bow has decoy, 100% pierce, and a massive attack skill.

They're also ranged making them more simple to use (less deaths).

People should consider Bow/KTN. It's much more skillful to the point of overwhelming. Slight decrease on damage on Sat and CF, but KTN skills in between these 2 skills should out DPS. Damage nerf on KTN is a shame tbh. Discourages skillful use.

 

Innate STR damage growth + crt dmg bonus from STR.

No anti-ranged bosses.

Stupid high MP Regen with no drawbacks. (Decoy)

Rarely would bosses ever react to bow ailments.

You need to get hit for godhand. Not very great for fractional spamming bosses.

Godhand's dmg reduction is shit.

ATK buff is useless on low ATK growth weapons.

Base growth from stats are garbage.

Flee is useless VS Hit which helps mitigate graze chance on low difficulty.

Almost all bow skills are useful in some way or the other.

Almost all martial skills are useless. Crusher skills are falling off as the game advances.

Goliath punch loses change and is bad when boss drops a spike trap on itself.

Goliath punch is an AoE not a targetted skill.

Crossfire's long charge lets you use it whilst using other skills.

Cross fire only stops charging and never loses its charge level when hit/at max.

Bow and arrow is Dual element destiny bound. Free +25% damage. No need to have any other sub weapon, just stack arrows and elemental bow.

Knuckles motion speed is slow vs bow at same attack speed. (Let that sink in.)

Bow has no risk to benefit ratio. Knux has max risk to benefit ratio.

 

While I agree with all the points mentioned, some of you seemed to have missed the point.

I meant raw damage, not damage per second, or any other class-specific advantages or disadvantages.

• Sub arrow has element so can use main weapon pot for other purposes
• On high def bosses, Satellite has a multiplier of 27-30 with 100% pierce
• The stats growth of Bow is better (although the gap is somewhat closed by Annihilator)
• Better stability of bow

These are the reasons I completely understand why we see more 'numbers' per hit on Bow.
I just wanted to know why is there so much discrepancy in the 'maximum possible damage' you can do with all the buffs.

 

Toram should nurf the sat arrow the damage is just too high 100k to 200k each shots would have been nice , but 1.8m 600k each shot is just too much, bow users are just being too toxic ,CF is also too strong as hell ._. Devs are just too stupid I guess

 

I think they already made another downside of CF, sometimes the highest damage dealer part of my CF misses if boss is moving so fast.
Maybe they'll "nerf" Satellite Arrow eventually but I don't expect it because of its pinpoint skill area is already a huge downside.
I also thought that Bow+Arrow users are "overrated" or "glorified" because of event bosses, many of them (or almost all) are only within Normal-Hard Difficulty, which this weapon class performs best. For me, Bow+Arrow is no match for some other weapon classes in ultimate difficulties, especially in bossfights where there are whole map attack/s (such as Tuscog).

Spoiler: Examples

CF Satellite has no ailment unlike and Chariot or Meteor Breaker;
-it will require lots of crit rate resources unlike DT and that THS dps skill
-not that good against neutral bosses unlike finale
-has no salvation skill unlike any other weapon classes.
-it can be terribly guarded or evaded (you charged for 15s+ then the boss just guards/evades or waited Satellite but enemy just goes away) but you're a magic or dps skill user, it'll be a lesser loss on total dmg dealt because you can cast the skill again within lesser intervals.

 

In bosses with lots of aoe, melee characters such as knuckle gets slaughtered because they can't evade on time from close distance, while bows with their very short combos and distance can easily run away. Also, everyone seemed to forget that besides satellite arrow, the devs has also buffed the damage of the 4 ailment skills of bow, arm break and smoke dust can deal more damage than snipe at first hit now. So for frequently moving bosses, bows can spam their 4 ailment skills instead of SA.

Also the new Ageladanios xtal that by far has the most OP damage stats pretty much promotes gsw glass cannon playstyle, guess who benefits the most from gsw playstyle and gets hit less often, bows.

So yes, in terms of pure dps, Bows/bowguns are pretty much the kings now.

 

Yes, edit: same goes for bows against boss with epicenter attacks of 7m+.
Another disadvantage of bow is "interval", unlike other weapon classes (except tragic current finale), bow users cannot just cast a skill and maintain the very same high damage amount; ailments have resist cooldowns, CF needs charge, Satellite has delay, even the projectile of normal attacks has an interval BUT it can be an advantage for healthy proration.

 

No matter what, Satellite is simply just too strong, its 100% pierce, is an AOE, and COSTS 300 MP and therefore more spammable than dragon tooth, it even has almost as much damage as dragon tooth, with no risks of dying. Combine this with OP mp regen from RANGED decoy shot, and bows can just sit there, charge cf, spam satellite, arm break, smoke dust, release cf, and repeat. It is just too efficient, with good ampr they don't even need to auto attack and can just cycle and spam all these excellent dps skills choices.

 

Imo Bow+Arrow are seemed to be OP because of their high burst capability, with CF having (10 + DEX/100) mult per stack + up to 4 additional shots from the last 4 stacks and one more shot from decoy (up to 77.5 in total at 5 stacks) and sat arrow having 9~12 mult per hit along with 100% physical pierce. That, plus Bow+Arrow being long-ranged and high mp recovery capability.

But there's a fact that is nothing is perfect. OP at things are, most of the time there will always be some downsides.

That 77.5 total multiplier of all hits seems to be very OP at first, but you know you have to wait for 35 seconds to reach that amount of stacks right? During that amount of time, those 10-12 mult meteor sc enchant tenryu spammers could surpass that already, even after including the time they spend to recover MP. It's better to launch CF at 3 stacks since it only requires 8 seconds for 47 mult, allowing you to deal 1.5 times the damage while spending the same amount of time. Or perhaps 2 stacks after 3 seconds of waiting for 29-30 mult. But whichever way, you'll still gonna have to "wait". And imagine that, due to circumstances, you're only able to fire CF at high stacks (like continuous AoE forcing you to run around nonstop to evade), only to see a glorious "EVASION" appears as if the game wants to f*ck with you. Also, if you're unfortunately enough to get hit, then I hope your CF stack amount is worth it.

And sat arrow, that multiplier number and physical pierce looks delicious, but only if they can hit. If the target doesn't move much then yeah no need to worry, at worst you may only miss one hit. Unfortunately not all targets want to stay in one place for long, and more unfortunate, many targets don't stay still longer than sat arrow's initial delay. Not to mention that it's not guaranteed that you can safely cast sat arrow at the perfect moment all the time. No matter how OP a skill can be, if it doesn't hit, it's meaningless. And the same problem with CF: see them arrows miss for whatever reason, then the only one that "hits" gave you a glorious "EVASION". Well, at least it's not as painful

For bow users, timing has a bigger impact on their performance. Meanwhile those aforementioned spammers can just prorate then spam until out of MP then recover then repeat.

But well, that's only if we only use CF and sat arrow. Since those debuff shots can be used as sub DPS there's less to worry about.

 

At this point, I'm pretty sure that other players have also already come to the conclusion that the devs don't really focus too much on balancing DPS between different weapon class, their idea of balance is by introducing difficult bosses where a certain weapon's utility skill is needed, like how knuckles' unique interrupt ability are always needed on gespenst hell, volgagon, and other bosses. How dual wield's phantom slash with freeze ailment is needed on megiston, where magic attacks are needed on gespenst hell 1st phase, magic attacks or buster blade are needed on Pyxtica, gatling knife is needed on empress hell, etc.

They're most likely gonna introduce future high difficulty bosses where a certain weapon tree's unique skill is necessary to beat it, that seems to be their idea of "balance", which is based on teamwork between different weapon class. And we can only go with the flow.