Open forum for Dual Wielder's healthy progress: Let's brainstorm and share our thoughts!

"Flash Blast damage is not
even significant why u need
to reduce it"

I thought that damage u refer in this comment is the single damage u made when u evade & Flash proc. Example 10k damage each time u hit. I thought u mean that he wants to reduce the exact damage it gives.

About Szchevs damage output, hes saying about is the overall damage that wil be reduce because he weaken the proc rate of Flash.

Sorry if I misundetstood u in anyway, but idk what damage are u refering the exact damage when it procs or the overall damage output when u keep using it when Flash proc reduce.

 

-Every proc's damage output will be reduced by 20% - 30%.

- Flash blast's damage output for every proc, not for overall damage because overall damage in one boss run(s) is impossible to calculate before the boss run(s) due to build's different skill choices, stat distribution, item choices and playstyle.

 

Lmao I thought u mean weaken its proc rate coz u dont mention/said it to weaken its damage. This is ur original post before u edit it thats why I thought u mean to weaken proc not damage

"I want flash blast's
proc to get weaken by
like .. 20% - 30% BUT .. I
want Shadowstep (a skill
that considered as an
evasion type skill) proc
Flash blast"

Btw NVM it coz it doesnt really matter coz its not a part of the real gameplay it just an idea after all

 

Now can we talk about our combos.

This is the two 1MP combos I mostly used:

Astute>Shadow(Save)>Twin(Smite)>Trigger(Cons)

Spin>Shadow(Save)>Twin(Smite)>Trigger(Cons)

I put Shadow in 2nd slot so I can quickly reposition myself to avoid front redzone aoes & a boost crit rate on my Twin. I knew its not a good dps combo, but it gives me consistent damage coz Twin always crit & if it crits it had a boosted CDMG. And, of course its a quick motion boosting combo that I use for auto canceling.

My Defensive 1MP combo:

Cross>Spin(Cons)>Shadow(Cons)

My Breaker 1MP combo:

Hard>Spin(Cons)>Shadow(Cons)
Or
Hard>Astute(Cons)>Trigger(Cons)

I always use short combos to ensure survivability.

 

° "For you, what is wrong in DW's scaling stats/skill tree and what do you wanna change for it to become an "OK" choice DPS-wise for new players?"

Let me just say there's nothing wrong with the scaling or skill tree (ofc flashblast and unsheathe need a little work put on em but meh) and tbh i wouldn't change anything to make it an "OK" choice for newbies reason why is cuz in itself DW isn't a "Let's get all the ranks, let's beat the shiz out of mages, 2h and snipers, BOW DOWN BEFORE MY MAGNUM DONG" build smfh .-. although I won't deny it can in some cases beat those classes as tfl has shown and by my own experience. The thing you need to understand is Dw is a class that shows its true potential as your lvl gets higher so if you wanna be guns blazing from the beginning of the game just don't pick it cuz that's probably not gonna happen. As many others have stated Dw shows its best potential near late end game and it's worth the time and effort to make one lol in my case I main a Dw and have had it since I started the game which is why I said that earlier, and have tried out practically all other builds/classes and its been the most fun and satisfying out of all of them^^

° "What specific buff(s) do you personally want Asobimo to implement to help your playstyle and improve your build overall?"

I'd like them to add more survival oriented skills and one or two buffs for def etc lol my playstyle is rather up close and personal since i generate a lot of aggro (more than most of the people I've pt'd with) I end up tanking/stealing ranks a lot cri :')

° "If you pick/main DW, what makes you decide to pick/main it?"

Cuz why not lmao I hate doing generic shiz like everyone else smh i like builds that you actually have to think about your next move unlike those that you just need to point click and repeat and Dw gives me that satisfaction

° "If not, What makes you decide not to pick/main it?"

I main and I love it.

° "What is your favorite skill to have as a DW?" (DW skill and non-DW skill.)

That would be Shadow Step and Astute/Trigger Slash ampr and crit 4 life lol

 

Maybe if I said "Decreased/Reduced", It might be very very confusing without "Damage output" after the word "Proc" because it will generalize the toning down part. I used the word "Weaken" to specify reduction of a "Damaging skill".

We should use the word "Weaken" whenever we're trying to specify a reduction towards "Damaging" skills and the evasion % proc chance is not one of them.

 

But if u weaken the proc it will also weaken the damage coz if Flash doesnt proc there will be no boost in damage.

In my thought even u weaken the damage output or the proc rate there will be damage reduction in both ways

 

Of course. That's the purpose of the word "Weaken." to reduce/decrease the damage output.

 

This is my current build. I post it here to discuss why I made it like this. I want to get feedback on ur opinions & suggestions about it. I had a permission from Szchev to post it here

Stats: Dex 200 > Str 97

My stat build is base on my own preference on the things that I need to prioritize and to make everything balance. Having Dex on my stat build is self-explenatory. So I will just discuss why I dont use Agi for now & why I chose Str as my second stat.

Agi increases Flee, ASPD & Subhand damage.

I dont need Flee coz I want to evade more for Flash Blast. Flee/Dodge is triggered 1st so it made u less evade. And, having dodge for survival it only MISS on physical/normal attacks. The real deal is the red zones that can be avoid by having the right timing of using ur skills/combo. IMO theres too many ways to ensure survival using skills like Shadow, Phantom & Cross. So giving up Flee is not really a big deal for me.

I dont need too much ASPD coz on 1000 ASPD the intervals of attacks became 0, for me its already enought. Starting from 1100+ it increases the Motion Speed of normal attacks. But, they already test it on having 1000 vs 3000 ASPD & theres no significant changes it just increase a little. Their conclusion excess ASPD is not worth getting. Lastly, about the theory that the motion speed from excess ASPD affects skill, its not proven.

And, about subhand damage I less need it coz I mostly depend on the skill/combo for the damage & im using auto canceling too.

Str increases a little ASPD, CDMG & the damage on both hands.

I thought that I will benefit more on Str coz I already cancel out Flee & ASPD on the effects of Agi. Then, I can maximize the increase CDMG coz of my crit rate equipments.

Equipment:
Main:Anniv @92+C A7%Cdmg7%Crate11
Xtalillar
Sub:Tomahawk
Armor:Light A7%Cdmg11Crate11
Xtal:Jade
Add Gear:Skull Cape
Xtal:Warmo
Special Gearex Tal 3
Xtal:SG

My equipments are designed to provide high crit rate for consistent damage & to increase base Atk. I still dont know if Astute adds +25% or +25 flat. If it adds as a % it will be 85% if it adds as a flat it becomes 93% crit rate. Pillar, Jade & SG are for increase AMPR & MaxMP.

 

This isn't a bad build if your main damaging tree are only 1H moves.
Let's dissect it one by one.

The stat distribution is okay; you get quite a bit of CDMG from the points you have in STR (3 more and you get 20, making it a total of 170 base CDMG). However, if you're using DW skills as a main damage source, you might regret it a bit: AGI gives 3 ATK to your offhand stat per point, and as you may know, offhand stat is a determining factor for their skills and autos. But if you rely on moves like Tempest to do the job, that point becomes moot.

About equips, I have one thing to say: you're squishy. Unlike Mages and Snipers, you can't attack from afar (unless you're a Power Wave user), and unlike Brawlers, we can't interrupt as well, so we often have to stand still and takes some hits if we want to do damage. Sure, you can rely on Phantom to save your butt every time, but that means you have to use it so often you'll be almost spamming (if not outright spamming). That leads to you:
- Getting aggro, forcing you to avoid more
- Screwing with almighty proration
Also, Goovua for example has autos that do over 2k damage once his HP is low, meaning your survival option will often be to not get hit at all (and that's almost impossible with higher level bosses).
For each individual equip:
- Main and offhand sword: Nothing wrong here
- Armor: Sorry if I sound rude, but why you would use ATK7% over CDMG7% is beyond me; with your stats, you can get 11,9 CDMG out of the latter. That's a 12% damage increase if you crit, and given your crit rate, it should happen almost all the time once Astute is up; also, it allows you to use Crate+11%, and while is effect is not very meaningful, it's still some extra crit rate to bump you to 95%; Other than that, read above for my reaction to your Xtal
- Add: Again, read above
- Special: Again, nothing wrong

These are the 2 cents of a noob, so take my infos with a pile of salt.

 

My main damaging skill is Twin Slash.

I knew that Im squishy but most of the time Im the one who tanks on the party & I dont had a problem doing it. I mostly abuse the use of Shadow to avoid front/linear aoes & use Cross Parry/Hard Hit if I had been caught on a big redzone aoe around the boss. I always use short combos to ensure that I can reposition quickly & having a good timing always saved me. Lastly, its good to get aggro coz I need to tank for evasion to proc so I can use Flash. Theres too many ways a DW can use to survive so it doesnt really a problem.
About proration I can just party on mages to solved it. I considered ur opinions/suggestions about my build.

This is the two 1MP combos I
mostly used:
Astute>Shadow(Save)>Twin
(Smite)>Trigger(Cons)
Spin>Shadow(Save)>Twin
(Smite)>Trigger(Cons)
I put Shadow in 2nd slot so I
can quickly reposition myself
to avoid front redzone aoes &
a boost crit rate on my Twin. I
knew its not a good dps
combo, but it gives me
consistent damage coz Twin
always crit & if it crits it had a
boosted CDMG. And, of course
its a quick motion boosting
combo that I use for auto
canceling.
My Defensive 1MP combo:
Cross>Spin(Cons)>Shadow
(Cons)
My Breaker 1MP combo:
Hard>Spin(Cons)>Shadow
(Cons)
Or
Hard>Astute(Cons)>Trigger
(Cons)

 

Well before that the missunderstanding solved about unsheathe thing lol.

But sorry to say... yep I agree with @TheXIIIthGuy it's..... mess up.........

 

@TheXIIIthGuy @Cella

Maybe its messy for other players taste but in my own point of view it is balance & suitable on my playstyle.

I thought that the increased CDMG from Str will replaced the damage loss from not having Agi for the subhand damage.

I also thought that having Twin Slash as my main damaging skill is more suitable coz it has the fastest animation compare with charging & phantom. It is suitable in using in a my two short motion boosting combos that I use for auto canceling.

About the survival I thought that with just the right timing of using skills/combo its already enough to fill my lack of HP.

About the Atk7% on my armor. I thought increasing my base Atk will also increased the CDMG Coz CDMG multiply the white damage from Atk. Also my Atk stat from 200 Dex is more higher than my CDMG from 97 Str. Im too lazy to test which is better in damage output Atk7% or Cdmg7%.

Lastly, I spam those two short combos reapetedly with auto canceling between them. Its already enough to get aggro to tank, so evasion can proc for flash. About proration, boss need different amount of hits to prorate. Example some boss needs 3 hits & other needs 12 or more hits to max prorate. So being said proration using by autos is not always the best option better join party with mages.

Btw tnx for sharing ur thoughs coz I need it for improvements

 

I respect your build because that's your reflection. your build is not only your "Character's build" but your "Own build" which reflects everything about your "way of thinking" and your "knowledge towards this specific class (Dual wield/wielder/sword/some people called it "trash" hehe)and your knowledge towards this game overall."

BUT ..

The main thing that I personally think that is actually not optimal at all but "can be improved", is your HP pool. having a high def refined armor but low HP pool is far worse compare to low def refined armor +1000 HP. What I'm trying to point out is, Go buy adv. garb 2slots and attach your Jade+Roga in it. Come on, Bosses are getting stronger and stronger as the patches comes by and nowadays, being squishy is a "WTF" kind of thing.

That's my only concern, everything about "YOUR" build is "YOUR" build. You made that one for a reason, "YOUR OWN PERSONAL REASON."

Your party member(s) and you honestly don't want someone to die in any boss runs or forcely flinch or tumble unflinchable/untumbleable bosses just for the sake of "someone's personal defensive reasons", and if you're going to say that this build will not tackle any given bosses (unflichable/untumbleable), that only means that this build disregards "flexibility" and "versatility" towards bosses behaviors.

 

Of course I wont use interrupt skill on those kind of bosses for the sake of saving my life. Im sure I will be kick if I do that. My current HP is 2100+ with HP Boost on survival skill tree & I always use Vita 2 so I got total of 3100+ HP when fighting. I think its enough for now. If I cant fight the upcoming Bosses with my current HP pool of course I will raise it so I wont be a burden on anyone

 

i actually liked the combo you posted... short and simple and high crit rate for twin slash
but if by any chance ur trigger slash is level 1-5
you can also use astute>trigger(save)>shadowstep(cons)>twin slash(smite)>spinning slash (swift) can work too i think
or if trigger is 6-10 then just switch spin to cons and you can still use aa cancelling

 

The difference is massive. between players maximizing aggro, Survivability and DPS.

Now let me tell you how that affects growth.
You're building a niche build if:
1. You prioritize DPS.
2. You prioritize Aggro.
3. You prioritize utility.

In all of the 3, the current viablity of all those. Number 2 has the highest potential for current in game meta.

Every one is too lazy to tank because they dont wanna lose damage up time. So yoy prioritize aggro hogging to be useful, and to get an ensured rank.

Number 1 on the other hand. Is viable in a sense that you can pull off good plays that will inevitably mark you as the main damage dealer.

Number 3 is always useful in any meta, but not everyone builds it. The game is all about dps, who cares about how much mp you have, how much hp you have, how much mp you get back from AAs, how much you can clutch your way in a battle.

There's a gap that should be filled first in terms of the conceptualization phase of a build.
Most players always think:
How much damage could I do on this build?
Can I get attacker?
What's a good dps combo?

Not many think:
Will I survive?
Am i too squishy?
Will I be able to take a hit?
Do i really need to spend money on vitas?

Offense is not always a good Defense.

 

I'm not PERSONALLY a fan of someone's build that actually uses buff pots just to maximize overall result or even just to make the boss(es) "Managable to kill."

Stability, Consistency, Versatility, Flexibility and Utility from your "build"s base potential" is the most important thing to have in my personal opinion.

If someone manage to defeat/kill someone/something without any buff used in that specific level cap/patch/boss' difficulty in a very clean way or if not, just in a very knowledgable way, imagine if that specific player(s) use some buff(s) while doing that specific run.

In my personal opinion, promotion of build(s) should have the potential to "balance everything first" and then "maximize specific part" but from a very safe and reliable base state.

 

Im just a little confused with this combo. If I put Spin on the last slot of the combo it will knockback the boss & I will be needing to walk before using auto. But, its a good counter coz after I knockback the boss I can choose if I walk away to avoid redzone aoe or get close to auto again.

Btw tnx for the suggestions @Szchev` & @Groot

 

I agree. But I dont had Spinas to buy a two slot arm for having Roga xtal so I will stick on Vita 2 for now